USrael - liars and warmongers

[Deleted User]
[Deleted User] Posts: 0
edited May 2018 in News & Current Events

The Netanjahu Israel war criminals have obviously succeeded to force the USrael president in Washington to set hopefully the final example on how the USA is a country ruled by Zionist deep state warmongers ... The Trump speech was opne big lie from start to finish ...
Iran supposedly sponsors AL-Queda and ISIS terrorists? Maybe that is why Iran is fighting and destroying those terrorists in Syria? Anyone already forgotten that it was the CIA (is that an Iranian secret service?) which created and sponsored Al-Queda as well as ISIS according to testimony and public statement made a few years ago by then secretary Hillary Clinton?

America's word is worthless

Do Americans want to die for Israel?

Looks like the USA real rulers absolutely desire war ... so much for the peace loving "greatest nation in the world"

«1

Comments

  • Dave_L
    Dave_L Posts: 2,362

    Has the US ever gone without a war? I cannot think of a time when they have not been up to their necks in something. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

  • @Dave_L said:
    Has the US ever gone without a war? I cannot think of a time when they have not been up to their necks in something. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

    There seems no correction needed as your remark appears to me to be very true. Unfortunately, all too many are deceived by talks of "peace, democracy, human rights, liberty etc". Interestingly, just looking at recent decades, which country that has been "liberated through bombing" (or should that be "deliberately bombed"?) is now doing better than before the USrael criminals started their illegal wars against those countries?

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463
    1. USrael? Don't go there.
    2. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.
    3. Mr. Trump continues to "wag the dog." Did you expect something different? CM
  • Dave_L
    Dave_L Posts: 2,362

    @C_M_ said:

    1. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.

    Shouldn't we love Palestinian Christians, and put those who murder them, and exist only because of their hatred of Christ and the church in their proper place?

  • @C_M_ said:
    1. USrael? Don't go there.

    you may not like it ... but it is more apparent than ever before who really rules the USA and who with extraordinary lobby influence basically dictates the neocon falcons' foreign policy.

    1. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.

    There are a few Israelites who understand ... and they are the ones who oppose the "Bibi and friends" course of aggression involving military attacks etc. in order to provoke an all out war (which he hopes the USA will then fight for Israel) ...

    1. Mr. Trump continues to "wag the dog." Did you expect something different? CM

    No, after the coup was successful to overturn him and convince him to do (or else ... remember Kennedy?), I am not expecting anything but the continuation of war to come out of Washington.
    The falcon bullies there not only threaten and undertake economic warfare against supposed "enemies" (such as Iran) but also against supposed friends (such as their EU vassal countries, like Germany, France, UK)

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    @Dave_L said:

    @C_M_ said:

    1. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.

    Shouldn't we love Palestinian Christians, and put those who murder them, and exist only because of their hatred of Christ and the church in their proper place?

    What about George Bush Jr.? Remember, the Iqai War? CM

  • Dave_L
    Dave_L Posts: 2,362

    @C_M_ said:

    @Dave_L said:

    @C_M_ said:

    1. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.

    Shouldn't we love Palestinian Christians, and put those who murder them, and exist only because of their hatred of Christ and the church in their proper place?

    What about George Bush Jr.? Remember, the Iqai War? CM

    Is God punishing America for supporting the State of Israel?

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463
    edited May 2018

    Wolfgang,
    To respond to all your points: Who's fault is it that the Americans have such poor leader in Mr. Trump? So, don't blame Israel for taking advantage of the moment. Can you blame Israel for being proactive to protect herself? I repeat, if anyone touches a hair on Israel's head, there won't be enough sky to hide under. Besides, American has a commitment to protect Israel. An unbreakable bond. CM

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    @Dave_L said:

    Is God punishing America for supporting the State of Israel?

    Why would you say such? Let the truth be told, America is punishing herself. CM

  • @Dave_L said:

    @C_M_ said:
    2. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.

    Shouldn't we love Palestinian Christians, and put those who murder them, and exist only because of their hatred of Christ and the church in their proper place?

    Indeed ....

    However, too many Christians seem to have blinded themselves by somehow thinking that the modern day state of Israel has something to do with Biblical Israel ...

  • @C_M_ said:
    What about George Bush Jr.? Remember, the Iqai War? CM

    what about that war of aggression for which the war mongers at the time should be put in front of a court and sentenced for the terrible war crimes they committed ?

  • Dave_L
    Dave_L Posts: 2,362

    @C_M_ said:

    @Dave_L said:

    Is God punishing America for supporting the State of Israel?

    Why would you say such? Let the truth be told, America is punishing herself. CM

    God told Abraham "And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.” (Genesis 12:3) (KJV 1900)

    It is the Palestinian Christians who are Abraham's Seed, not their persecutors.

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    @Wolfgang said:

    @Dave_L said:

    @C_M_ said:
    2. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.

    Shouldn't we love Palestinian Christians, and put those who murder them, and exist only because of their hatred of Christ and the church in their proper place?

    Indeed ....

    However, too many Christians seem to have blinded themselves by somehow thinking that the modern day state of Israel has something to do with Biblical Israel ...

    I am not a dispensationalist.

    @Wolfgang said:
    what about that war of aggression for which the warmongers at the time should be put in front of a court and sentenced for the terrible war crimes they committed?

    I'm not here to defend America and its war business. Take USA to the "World Court." CM

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    I am disappointed that Israel served the Japanese Prime Minister a shoe with chocolate. What were they thinking? CM

  • reformed
    reformed Posts: 3,176

    @Wolfgang said:
    The Netanjahu Israel war criminals have obviously succeeded to force the USrael president in Washington to set hopefully the final example on how the USA is a country ruled by Zionist deep state warmongers ... The Trump speech was opne big lie from start to finish ...
    Iran supposedly sponsors AL-Queda and ISIS terrorists? Maybe that is why Iran is fighting and destroying those terrorists in Syria? Anyone already forgotten that it was the CIA (is that an Iranian secret service?) which created and sponsored Al-Queda as well as ISIS according to testimony and public statement made a few years ago by then secretary Hillary Clinton?

    America's word is worthless

    Do Americans want to die for Israel?

    Looks like the USA real rulers absolutely desire war ... so much for the peace loving "greatest nation in the world"

    Ok fact check,

    The President never said Iran sponsored Al-Queda. And how exactly did the CIA create Al Qaeda? That's a big stretch.

    @Dave_L said:

    @C_M_ said:

    1. Israel needs security. She understands the region. She has her faults, but love her.

    Shouldn't we love Palestinian Christians, and put those who murder them, and exist only because of their hatred of Christ and the church in their proper place?

    ???? Who said we don't love Palestinian Christians?

    @C_M_ said:
    Wolfgang,
    To respond to all your points: Who's fault is it that the Americans have such poor leader in Mr. Trump? So, don't blame Israel for taking advantage of the moment. Can you blame Israel for being proactive to protect herself? I repeat, if anyone touches a hair on Israel's head, there won't be enough sky to hide under. Besides, American has a commitment to protect Israel. An unbreakable bond. CM

    Where is the poor leadership? I'm confused.

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    @reformed said:

    Where is the poor leadership? I'm confused.

    Watch American News Channels. Go to the Internet, etc. CM

  • reformed
    reformed Posts: 3,176

    @C_M_ said:

    @reformed said:

    Where is the poor leadership? I'm confused.

    Watch American News Channels. Go to the Internet, etc. CM

    I've actually been impressed with the leadership overall.

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    @reformed said:

    I've actually been impressed with the leadership overall.

    "Impressed" with the presidential leadership? About what and at whose expenses?

    On second thought, one man's standards of leadership is another man's disappointment. Don't take my word for it, ask over 50% of Americans. CM

    PS. What leader would suggest guns in the classroom, etc.?

  • reformed
    reformed Posts: 3,176

    @C_M_ said:

    @reformed said:

    I've actually been impressed with the leadership overall.

    "Impressed" with the presidential leadership? About what and at whose expenses?

    On second thought, one man's standards of leadership is another man's disappointment. Don't take my word for it, ask over 50% of Americans. CM

    PS. What leader would suggest guns in the classroom, etc.?

    First, lots of leaders suggest guns in the classroom.

    Further, leadership is what has brought North Korea to the table and released hostages, leadership has helped the economy and lowered unemployment, leadership helped get rid of the individual mandate. And in case you forgot, the 50% number you cited is not about leadership, it is about job approval. Yes, leadership is part of that, but you can't judge leadership on an approval poll, not to mention the margin of error etc...

    But President Trump is getting the job done that he was elected by this nation to do. I understand you don't like it but the country overall did not agree with your positions. It was time for a drastically different direction than the dreadful Obama years of abuse and tyranny.

    Now, do I agree with the President's morals? Absolutely not, but that is only one piece of a man. Policy-wise, he has been spot on for the most part.

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited May 2018

    Seems like Putin has surrendered to the USrael war-mongers ... even had the worst war criminal and super Nazi walking at his side at the victory parade in Moscow yesterday. How can one remember the victory in the very costly war against Nazi-Germany and at the same time walk openly next to the super-Nazi of today at the same time?

    In case you wonder why I would call that top liar a "Nazi" ... yes, the Israel regime just as the Washington regime are acting as Nazis with Nazi methods, such as boycotting other countries without reason, and threatening, attacking and destroying them, instigating and carrying out coups to overthrow legal and democratically elected governments, and murder people in numbers of thousands and over some years even millions.

    Seems like the psychopaths are ready to start their long planned wars against Iran and flare up their war against Syria ...

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    Wolfgang,

    Ha! Higher taxes and higher gas prices, all on the backs of the American Poor.

    Look at Canada, Israel, and Germany for true leaders of growing countries with freedom for its people.

    Why don't Syria leave Israel alone? Israel is striking back. She was right about Iran in Syria. Now, you see why Israel has to be proactive in some areas? CM

  • @C_M_ said:
    Wolfgang,
    Ha! Higher taxes and higher gas prices, all on the backs of the American Poor.

    no difference over here ... exploitation of the "99%" by the "1%".

    Look at Canada, Israel, and Germany for true leaders of growing countries with freedom for its people.

    I don't know much about Canada .... but Israel has a dictator and top war-criminal Nazi as leader and Germany a crooked woman who acts as the willing "disaster leader" of the USA vassal country ... German people are seemingly least on her mind, as she has been violating her oath of office for quite a while and only now more people realize the disaster this woman has brought upon the country.

    Why don't Syria leave Israel alone? Israel is striking back.

    Sorry, C_M but Syria has not attacked Israel ...they are busy defending against USA and Israel support IS and Al-Nusra inside their country. Israel and the USA has been active in Syria militarily in total violation of international law as they carry out their Nazi goal of "regime change".

    She was right about Iran in Syria. Now, you see why Israel has to be proactive in some areas? CM

    No, I see Israel conducting aggression against other countries based on blatant lies. They carry on in the fashion of Colin Powell with his false accusations and lies about Iraq at the UN security council to justify an invasion and war against Iraq. At least, he admitted years later that he had lied and the matter about Saddam's "weapons of mass destruction" had been a hoax and that his act at the UN had been a great shameful blemish on his life and career. The Bibi Nazi recently conducted a similar TV show lying ceremony about Iran.
    Iran is helping in Syria with a limited number of military forces in Syria upon request of the Syrian government to fight against IS and other terrorists to put down USA and Israel sponsored regime change terrorist militants. Iranians in Syria have not attacked Israel ... unless you want to call attacks and defeat of Israel supported ISIS forces an attack on Israel; is that your point?

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463
    edited May 2018

    @reformed said:

    But President Trump is getting the job done that he was elected by this nation to do. I understand you don't like it but the country overall did not agree with your positions. It was time for a drastically different direction than the dreadful Obama years of abuse and tyranny.

    Now, do I agree with the President's morals? Absolutely not, but that is only one piece of a man. Policy-wise, he has been spot on for the most part.

    Reformed,
    You may want to seriously review Leadership Character independent of your political party preferences. Consider Mr. Trump's personal leadership character, style, integrity, giftedness, relational skills, and passion. A track record of integrity should be apart of your consideration in view of quality leadership. You seem to be overlooking credible interpersonal relationships on multiple levels; in addition to self- control, organizational leaders, “respectable”, guidance, care, and humility. All I can say what are the qualities or characteristics you admire most, or that you think are most important, in a leader?

    When time permits, it may be helpful for you to invest some time in considering true leadership. CM

    SOURCE:

    -- Clinton, R.J. (2012). The making of a leader: Recognizing the lessons and stages of leadership development(2nd ed.). Colorado Springs, CO: Navpress.

    -- Fisher, S. R., & Martrini, P. J. (2004). Inspiring leadership character and ethics matter. King of Prussia, PA: Academy Leadership.

    -- Sendjaya, S., Sarros, J. C., & Santora, J. C. (2008). Defining and measuring servant
    leadership behaviour in organization. Journal of Management Studies, 45(2), 402-424.

    -- Sendjaya, S. (2007). Conceptualizing and measuring spiritual leadership in organizations. International Journal of Business and Information, 2(1), 104-126.

  • C Mc
    C Mc Posts: 4,463

    @Wolfgang said:

    Iran is helping in Syria with a limited number of military forces in Syria upon request of the Syrian government to fight against IS and other terrorists to put down USA and Israel sponsored regime change terrorist militants. Iranians in Syria have not attacked Israel ... unless you want to call attacks and defeat of Israel supported ISIS forces an attack on Israel; is that your point?

    Please, Wolfgang! "...Request of the Syrian government to fight against IS", who believe this?

    unless you want to call attacks and defeat of Israel supported ISIS forces an attack on Israel; is that your point?

    No, Protecting interests. Israel must think ahead. She is in that corner by her self. This is why Germany and the USA must help her. CM

  • @C_M_ said:

    @Wolfgang said:
    Iran is helping in Syria with a limited number of military forces in Syria upon request of the Syrian government to fight against IS and other terrorists to put down USA and Israel sponsored regime change terrorist militants. Iranians in Syria have not attacked Israel ... unless you want to call attacks and defeat of Israel supported ISIS forces an attack on Israel; is that your point?

    Please, Wolfgang! "...Request of the Syrian government to fight against IS", who believe this?

    Why do you not believe this known fact (just as Russia acts militarily in Syria upon request of the Syrian government in support of fighting IS, Al-Nusra terrorists)?

    Israel's regime has built the largest concentration camp ever seen ... and USA and Germany and some others are supporting it ? Who is the crazy psychopath?

    unless you want to call attacks and defeat of Israel supported ISIS forces an attack on Israel; is that your point?


    No, Protecting interests.

    Oh, for sure they are "protecting interests" ... their interests however are NOT what you perhaps think they are. Their deeds have shown the opposite of their words plenty of times ... and the USA or Germany are "supporting" this scheme because they are ruled from behind the scenes by the AngloZionist empire.

    Israel must think ahead. She is in that corner by her self. This is why Germany and the USA must help her. CM

    Help her and join her in war crimes, crimes against humanity ?

  • reformed
    reformed Posts: 3,176

    @C_M_ said:

    @reformed said:

    But President Trump is getting the job done that he was elected by this nation to do. I understand you don't like it but the country overall did not agree with your positions. It was time for a drastically different direction than the dreadful Obama years of abuse and tyranny.

    Now, do I agree with the President's morals? Absolutely not, but that is only one piece of a man. Policy-wise, he has been spot on for the most part.

    Reformed,
    You may want to seriously review Leadership Character independent of your political party preferences. Consider Mr. Trump's personal leadership character, style, integrity, giftedness, relational skills, and passion. A track record of integrity should be apart of your consideration in view of quality leadership. You seem to be overlooking credible interpersonal relationships on multiple levels; in addition to self- control, organizational leaders, “respectable”, guidance, care, and humility. All I can say what are the qualities or characteristics you admire most, or that you think are most important, in a leader?

    When time permits, it may be helpful for you to invest some time in considering true leadership. CM

    SOURCE:

    -- Clinton, R.J. (2012). The making of a leader: Recognizing the lessons and stages of leadership development(2nd ed.). Colorado Springs, CO: Navpress.

    -- Fisher, S. R., & Martrini, P. J. (2004). Inspiring leadership character and ethics matter. King of Prussia, PA: Academy Leadership.

    -- Sendjaya, S., Sarros, J. C., & Santora, J. C. (2008). Defining and measuring servant
    leadership behaviour in organization. Journal of Management Studies, 45(2), 402-424.

    -- Sendjaya, S. (2007). Conceptualizing and measuring spiritual leadership in organizations. International Journal of Business and Information, 2(1), 104-126.

    All I know is he has gotten more done than the last 4 presidents. I'm looking for results, that's what the country needs, not a bunch of rhetoric with no meat. I'm willing to look past his personality and moral fiber for results. He is not my pastor. If he was my pastor I would look at the situation differently.

  • Bill_Coley
    Bill_Coley Posts: 2,675

    @reformed said:
    All I know is he has gotten more done than the last 4 presidents. I'm looking for results, that's what the country needs, not a bunch of rhetoric with no meat. I'm willing to look past his personality and moral fiber for results. He is not my pastor. If he was my pastor I would look at the situation differently.

    In my view, reformed, your claim that the president "has gotten more done than the last 4 presidents" is not at all supported by the facts. His only significant legislative achievement is a tax cut/reform bill that was and continues to be opposed by a significant majority of Americans, and that is not putting money in the paychecks of middle class workers NEARLY as much as the president promised, while it raises significantly both corporate profits and the take home pay of the richest among us.

    His Supreme Court nominee, heralded by his right-wing political base, gained senate confirmation only because the senate's majority leader took two extraordinary and deplorable actions: For a full year, he refused to consider President Obama's nominee to fill the vacancy; and he deployed the "nuclear option," which allowed the Senate to confirm Neil Gorsuch without the 60 vote majority required of all modern-day nominees.

    The rest of the president's "achievements" have come from executive orders - the kind of executive orders folks on the political right complained to high heaven about during the Obama administration. And of course, there was the travel ban, which most courts ruled unconstitutional, but which will likely pass muster with the current edition of the Supreme Court, particularly since Mr. Gorsuch is on board thanks to the senate's serious breaks with its own practice.

    Then there's his ties with Russia, which with every new revelation seem more serious, not less (that's an aspect of the Mueller probe few pay enough attention to: Every time there's a new revelation about the investigation, it's bad news for Trump - the hole gets deeper. Every leaks provides inculpatory, not exculpatory, details). But I won't go there, in deference to the morality thing you raised, reformed.

    Mr Trump has, by all accounts, lied more often and about more things than any president on record. He has lied about personal matters and about matters of state, matters directly related to his service as president of the United States. In my nearly 50 years of paying close attention to national politics, I have never seen anything close to the president's mendacity, in any president or member of congress, of either major political party. The Washington Post's collection of the president's false or misleading statements since taking office 16 months ago currently holds more than 3,000 items.

    I get that you have different expectations of presidents than you do of pastors, but what expectation do you have when it comes to presidents' telling the truth? Yes, every president speaks falsehoods, every president lies. But by orders of magnitude, no president has ever lied as much as has Donald Trump.

    In my view, truth-telling is fundamental to American democracy, and hence, required of presidents. As a result, I believe every presidential lie is in some sense harmful to our system, but serial, pathological lying, such as we have endured from President Trump, imperils our system.

    Lying is clearly a moral issue. But when the president of the United States is a serial liar, as is Mr Trump, for the country it's much more than a moral issue. What's your view of the impact and importance of repeated presidential lying?

  • reformed
    reformed Posts: 3,176

    @Bill_Coley said:

    @reformed said:
    All I know is he has gotten more done than the last 4 presidents. I'm looking for results, that's what the country needs, not a bunch of rhetoric with no meat. I'm willing to look past his personality and moral fiber for results. He is not my pastor. If he was my pastor I would look at the situation differently.

    In my view, reformed, your claim that the president "has gotten more done than the last 4 presidents" is not at all supported by the facts. His only significant legislative achievement is a tax cut/reform bill that was and continues to be opposed by a significant majority of Americans, and that is not putting money in the paychecks of middle class workers NEARLY as much as the president promised, while it raises significantly both corporate profits and the take home pay of the richest among us.

    Legislative achievements are for Congress, not the President. That is not how I measure a President's success. That being said, I don't see the reality of your statements regarding the tax bill. We see quite the opposite in real-world America. People are getting hired, wages are increasing, bonuses being given out.

    His Supreme Court nominee, heralded by his right-wing political base, gained senate confirmation only because the senate's majority leader took two extraordinary and deplorable actions: For a full year, he refused to consider President Obama's nominee to fill the vacancy; and he deployed the "nuclear option," which allowed the Senate to confirm Neil Gorsuch without the 60 vote majority required of all modern-day nominees.

    Two problems with this statement:

    1. It was not an extraordinary or deplorable act by the Majority Leader. Remember, Democrats, including Joe Biden, agreed with him when they were in power and Harry Reid made the same kind of moves. 2. the 60-vote majority was a recent iteration of Senate Rules and has not been required a majority of the existence of this country.

    The rest of the president's "achievements" have come from executive orders - the kind of executive orders folks on the political right complained to high heaven about during the Obama administration. And of course, there was the travel ban, which most courts ruled unconstitutional, but which will likely pass muster with the current edition of the Supreme Court, particularly since Mr. Gorsuch is on board thanks to the senate's serious breaks with its own practice.

    No there is a difference between the EO from the Obama Years and the Trump Administration. Trump is acting within his actual Constitutional Authority, Obama went well outside of that. The travel ban will be upheld because it is lawful by US Statute and it is absurd to even argue otherwise.

    Then there's his ties with Russia, which with every new revelation seem more serious, not less (that's an aspect of the Mueller probe few pay enough attention to: Every time there's a new revelation about the investigation, it's bad news for Trump - the hole gets deeper. Every leaks provides inculpatory, not exculpatory, details). But I won't go there, in deference to the morality thing you raised, reformed.

    Actually, from where I am sitting, these allegations of Russian ties get more absurd by the day. No evidence that there are any such ties, no real teeth to this investigation, AND the investigation got a big slap in the face by a Federal Judge just a couple of weeks ago musing that they are likely way outside of their scope of investigation with an agenda at heart.

    Mr Trump has, by all accounts, lied more often and about more things than any president on record. He has lied about personal matters and about matters of state, matters directly related to his service as president of the United States. In my nearly 50 years of paying close attention to national politics, I have never seen anything close to the president's mendacity, in any president or member of congress, of either major political party. The Washington Post's collection of the president's false or misleading statements since taking office 16 months ago currently holds more than 3,000 items.

    I agree he gets facts wrong often.

    I get that you have different expectations of presidents than you do of pastors, but what expectation do you have when it comes to presidents' telling the truth? Yes, every president speaks falsehoods, every president lies. But by orders of magnitude, no president has ever lied as much as has Donald Trump.

    I do agree he should be honest, but that has nothing to do with his accomplishments and the better direction of the country overall than the Obama years.

    In my view, truth-telling is fundamental to American democracy, and hence, required of presidents. As a result, I believe every presidential lie is in some sense harmful to our system, but serial, pathological lying, such as we have endured from President Trump, imperils our system.

    I agree with the premise of this statement but not the hyperbole of this statement.

    Lying is clearly a moral issue. But when the president of the United States is a serial liar, as is Mr Trump, for the country it's much more than a moral issue. What's your view of the impact and importance of repeated presidential lying?

    I haven't really seen an impact.

  • Bill_Coley
    Bill_Coley Posts: 2,675

    @reformed said:
    Legislative achievements are for Congress, not the President. That is not how I measure a President's success. That being said, I don't see the reality of your statements regarding the tax bill. We see quite the opposite in real-world America. People are getting hired, wages are increasing, bonuses being given out.

    Absent a veto override, Congress can't have any legislative achievements without the president's consent/signature, so in my view, your assertion that such achievements are for Congress not the president is incorrect, especially so since Mr Trump advocated for the tax cut both during congressional action and since he signed it. It's his bill.

    The modest effects of the tax cut on middle class households has been widely reported, as has the exaggerated importance of the corporate bonuses, bonuses cheerfully distributed by corporations that received billions of dollars in tax breaks thanks to the law Trump signed.

    1. It was not an extraordinary or deplorable act by the Majority Leader. Remember, Democrats, including Joe Biden, agreed with him when they were in power and Harry Reid made the same kind of moves. 2. the 60-vote majority was a recent iteration of Senate Rules and has not been required a majority of the existence of this country.

    It's incorrect to say Harry Reid made the same kind of move when he was majority leader. In November 2013, senate Democrats used the so-called "nuclear option" to break GOP filibuster on Obama judicial nominees below Supreme Court nominees. That is, the Democrats specifically excluded Supreme Court nominations from their action.

    As for Joe Biden, as I bet you know, in a senate floor speech on June 25, 1992, Biden recommended that in the event of a court vacancy, the president should not nominate and the Senate should not act on any nomination until after the election.

    Notice some key differences between what Biden recommended and what McConnell did:

    • Biden made his recommendation in late June of an election year, more than three months later in the election year than Obama nominated Merrick Garland, and just eighteen days before the start of that year's Democratic National Convention. Obama nominated Garland 124 days before the start of the Republican National Convention.
    • In his 1992 senate floor speech, Biden recommended that the president delay nominating someone, and/or the senate delay considering a nomination "until after the November election is completed." The election was over starting November 9, 2016, meaning the senate had two+ months to consider the Garland nomination after the election, but did not.

    No there is a difference between the EO from the Obama Years and the Trump Administration. Trump is acting within his actual Constitutional Authority, Obama went well outside of that. The travel ban will be upheld because it is lawful by US Statute and it is absurd to even argue otherwise.

    Your assessment of the Obama EOs is your partisan political view. So be it.

    Several federal courts have not found it "absurd even to argue" that the travel ban is unconstitutional.

    Actually, from where I am sitting, these allegations of Russian ties get more absurd by the day. No evidence that there are any such ties, no real teeth to this investigation, AND the investigation got a big slap in the face by a Federal Judge just a couple of weeks ago musing that they are likely way outside of their scope of investigation with an agenda at heart.

    No ties? Remember when the chorus from the Trumpsters union was that NO ONE in the campaign had even a single meeting with Russians? Now what is the count? At least 17 campaign people had at least one contact, and the total number of contacts might be over 75? Does ANYONE believe such a large number of campaign contacts with Russians was just coincidence? That every presidential campaign has five or six dozen contacts with Russians every election cycle?

    And then there's the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting, which Don Jr took because he was offered dirt on Hillary Clinton from the Russian government in its efforts to help Trump win the election. Nothing to see there! :tongue:

    I agree he gets facts wrong often.

    Getting facts wrong is something we all do, but only occasionally and often by mistake. What Donald Trump does is get the facts wrong serially, because he can't help himself, because he is a pathological liar.

    I do agree he should be honest, but that has nothing to do with his accomplishments and the better direction of the country overall than the Obama years.

    Is there ANY level of dishonesty - of abject disregard for the truth - that would lead you to give up your support for the president? Or in your view, do the ends justify the means, even if those means include pathological lying?

    I haven't really seen an impact. (of the President's serial lying)

    With due respect, reformed, I contend that one impact of the president's lying is seen in your response. So accustomed to presidential mendacity have become many people, that they don't really care that he stretches, ignores, or blows up the truth as long as he does what he said he would do. Many of the people who today turn away in disregard for such lying used to say "character counts," and shouted at the top of their moral lungs when Bill Clinton lied to a grand jury about his sex life. We live in a post-truth age today, to a significant degree because Trump's unrelenting lies have numbed our culture to the moral impact of falsehoods.

    A Trump staffer at a meeting this week said John McCain's opinion about the CIA director nominee didn't matter because "he's dying anyway." You think that kind of statement would EVER have come from a GW Bush, or Reagan, or Obama White House without the person's being fired immediately? Yet in a Trump White House, she's still on the job. Trump has degraded civility as well as our regard for truth.

  • GaoLu
    GaoLu Posts: 1,368
    edited May 2018

    @Bill_Coley

    A Trump staffer at a meeting this week said John McCain's opinion about the CIA director nominee didn't matter because "he's dying anyway." You think that kind of statement would EVER have come from a GW Bush, or Reagan, or Obama White House without the person's being fired immediately?

    Judging by your tone in this and most other posts, you would personally have no reluctance to say such a thing yourself.

    By the way, I do still exist. But life has been hopping elsewhere with very good things :)

Sign In or Register to comment.

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Who's Online 0